can we have ‘classicists against white supremacy’// ‘classicists against patriarchy’ // ‘classicists against eurocentrism’ // patches
because we’re actually at the ground of what the hate groups and right parties are trying to claim as their own and use as a weapon against others – so it’s time to take back that narrative.
Okay, I thought I was going to wake up for like five seconds and then go back to sleep but I started fucking around with this and I really got into it so now I’ve been working on this for an hour and I’m not done.
First, I want to talk a little bit about the symbol I chose, and of course I’m open to suggestions. While the owl is often known because of its connection to Athena and is thus often seen as a symbol of wisdom, in this case I also picked it because of its dual – and much wider – association with death. This is a worldwide association; though not every culture associates the owl with death and destruction, many more associate it with death than associate it with wisdom. I thought that was a very potent symbol for what’s being expressed here: what ‘classical’/white thought has expressed as wisdom is often death and destruction to other cultures, as well as the fact that what is being expressed here is a death or destruction to a supremacist way of thinking.
Second, the layouts here use a font called Norse. There are a LOT of other fonts that I can choose, and I am going to do a few more mock-ups with those in a bit. I really like Norse, it stitches very cleanly, and it has the added benefit of looking a) ‘generic classical, like it was cut in rock,’ and b) also looking pretty Norse if you realize that yeah I’m probably thumbing my nose at the people ruining Norse mythology and symbolism. (I’m open to font suggestions.)
I’ve listed this in the shop; it should stitch without an issue, but I’ll be testing it once the current run finishes. (Yes, my machine’s been running all night, the DE Punk Rock Flea Market is in a week, I’m busy!)
Thanks for tagging me in on this, I hope this is something people like. As always I am a one-person shop manned by a queer Jewish disabled person, so if you do choose to pick one up, thanks for supporting independent artists. 🙂
😀 😀 😀
A medievalist friend of mine requested an additional one and so I am adding:
hey so protip if you have abusive parents and need to get around the house as quietly as possible, stay close to furniture and other heavy stuff because the floor is settled there and it’s less likely to creak
socks are quieter than bare feet on tile/wood and for the love of god don’t wear slippers/shoes if you can help it
climbing ON the furniture will disrupt the pattern of your footsteps and make it harder to hear where you are in the house
crawling will do the same and if you get caught crawling you can pretend you fell
the floor near the wall can be really loud if the floorboards/carpet is old and not completely flush to the wall
do NOT attempt to use a rolling chair to travel without footsteps. they are extremely loud and hard to steer
Also. Breath with your mouth and not your nose. Your nose will whistle. Trust me. If you need to get into your fridge, jab your finger into the rubber part that seals the door closed and create a tiny airway. This will prevent the suction noise when you open the door. When drinking liquids (juice mostly), pour out your glass (or chug from the jug) and replace what you drank with water. If it was full enough in the beginning, no one will notice. DO NOT STEAL ALCOHOL. THEY WILL NOTICE IF IT’S WATERED DOWN. Bring a pillowcase for dried foods like cereal and granola. It helps to muffle the sound it makes when it pours.
If your house has snack packs (like gummy bears or crackers or chips), count them every day until you know the rhythm that they get consumed. (This took me a week and a half with my twin brother and sister). Then join the rhythm when you make your nightly visits. It will be that much harder to figure out it was you.
KEEP A TRASH BAG UNDER YOUR BED FOR WRAPPERS AND STUFF BUT DONT FORGET TO THROW IT OUT WHENEVER YOU CAN. BUGS YKNOW. Hope this helped.
I might have some useful info to add.
-a jar of peanut butter is long lasting and easy to hide under a bed or in a dresser drawer. I lived off of jars of peanut butter and boxes of saltine crackers I would buy on grocery trips with my mom.
-two words: Slipper Socks. These are the socks that have rubber designs on the bottom for grip. They make no noise, and also keep you steady on slicker surfaces like tile and wood. You can find them cheap at Walmart. They also keep your feet more protected if you’re outside.
-if you’re secure enough in your room to have a small food stash, make sure you’re not too obvious about it (duh) but also move its location every few days. I kept mine in a shoebox under my bed, then switched it to a backpack in my closet, then wedged between my bookshelf and wall, and I would cycle locations until i moved it permanently to a false-bottomed drawer I installed in my dresser when my father was gone for a weekend. I would NEVER put food directly into my stash after taking it. I would keep it in pockets of my clothes and between books until everyone went to sleep, then I’d stock and stow my stash for the next few days.
-get a water bottle with a filter in it. I used to be able to reach my bathroom from my bedroom door down the hall using a huge step or minor jump/leap. If I was afraid of being caught at night, I’d fill up the humidifier tank we kept under our sink while I took a short shower, and would refill my water that way. It might not be the best option, but I kept a small stockade of water under my bed for emergencies.
-if you can, smuggle your garbage out in your backpack or purse. Dispose of it at work/school. I got caught twice by carelessly throwing away packaging.
-if someone knows the situation you’re going through (close friend/partner/etc) see if there’s a way for them to get food or other supplies to you at school or work or what private time you may get. A hidden first aid kit literally saved parts of my body before and I owe it to a close friend.
-try learning the building’s natural rhythm. The house I grew up in would creak and settle heavily every night for 3-5 minutes. That was my shot, and I had to be QUICK. I still got caught a few times, but learning the patterns in our floors and walls, when they creaked, WHERE they creaked, kept me going. Eventually I was sprinting in slipper socks to the kitchen and back in less than 90 seconds.
-if you have stairs, or live upstairs. Sit as you go down them one at a time, or climb up them like an animal. It keeps you low/out of lots of motion sight, and also can reduce noise and creaking by distributing weight over more than 1-2 steps.
-You can use common hand sanitizer to remove the stains certain snack foods leave behind (coughs cheeto fingers) and a dry toothbrush can help scrub the color off your tongue. If you can get powdered toothpaste or toothpaste tabs to keep on hand, it makes a huge difference in sneakiness.
-I don’t recommend going for dried foods like granola or cereal unless you can sneak it to a secure place to get it. It’s too loud, it’s a gamble every time for something with less caloric intake than it’s worth if you get caught. Of course, there are times when that’s the only option!!
-if you’re taking milk, add water, but be SURE to shake/agitate the bottle to distribute the dairy fat with the water. I got into the habit of shaking milk jugs when I started sneaking it, and explained the habit as something I read in an old comic strip my father showed me. (Back when whole milk had a lot more cream fats and they’d separate, so shaking it would redistribute the cream.) I still shake milk jugs to this day.
-if your windows open or don’t have screens, eat leaning out an open window. Any food mess will be lost in the dirt. I was lucky I had bushes and birds outside that would catch my granola bar crumbs before anyone could notice.
-canned goods are tempting, but not worth it. It requires too many tools (can opener/strained sometimes/utensils/some need heat) stick to thinks like various nut butters (sunflower/peanut/almond), crackers, dried fruit, and easy to conceal food bars (nature valley/nutrigrain/etc.) dried ramen packets are good uncooked if you can stand the texture. Apple sauce and pudding cups are also easier to sneak and stash than one might think, and can be eaten with your fingers. The only canned foods I recommend are condensed soups and precooked pasta (spaghetti-o’s). You can easily mix them with a little bit of hot water from the tap and get something more sustaining than a handful of captain Crunch. The cans are cheap, sometimes recyclable, and drinking soup takes way less time than chewing solid food.
-if you menstruate, attempt to stash pads/tampons in a safe location. Sometimes shit happens. Pads can work as bandages in emergency situations. Sometimes shark week comes unexpectedly. If you can sneak a roll of toilet paper or paper towels, these are also life savers.
-plastic utensils from takeout containers can be hidden inside socks and will be worth their weight in gold when you least expect it. I bought myself a tiny plastic bowl from the dollar store and kept cheap trinkets in it on my desk so it didn’t seem like a bowl I was eating out of. You could try this with something like a mason jar, which is also useful for drinking out of or storing water.
-if you’re eating a crunchy or solid food, try soaking it in water. Mushy food can be repulsive in texture, but I could clock the sound of someone eating a nature valley oat bar from like 6 miles away. Dunking it in water (or using a secret bowl+water) can reduce noise, and also eating time since you don’t have to chew as much.
-keep a laundry bar or tide pen on you. Laundry bars are super useful, a little hard to find though. I washed a lot of stains out of my clothes with laundry bars in my bathroom sink as a kid. Not proud if it, but it kept me flying under the radar at school.
-clear rubber bands, plain twine or string, paper clips, and thumb tacks. Indescribably useful. I once rigged a system to open tricky cabinets and get objects from inside using two paper clips and a foot of plain string like a mock lasso system.
-if you’re pulling objects from tall cabinets, use your chest or stomach to cushion them. Let them fall into your torso and then into your hands cradled underneath. Not as loud, not as much grabbing, if someone sees it they can mistake it for it falling on you by the body language.
-get a bandana. Or four. Napkins, bandages, tool, and accessory all in one.
-get a tiny sewing kit. I’m talking 3 needles and a spool of thread tiny. Scissors if you can sneak it. See things into your clothes. Make hidden pockets or compartments. Threadbanger on YouTube did a video a few years ago about sneaking things into music festivals using tiny clothing mods, but they may be useful in sneaking money or medicine.
-on the topic of sneaking money. don’t take bills, take change. If your abusers don’t meticulously count their nickels and pennies, they’re an easy(ish) way to build up a tiny savings pool. I found nickels the least noticed coin I took, even more than pennies, and taking two every few nights from where they’d be tossed on our countertop soon built up to a semi-reliable fund I passed off to someone to get me food for my stash without having to sneak it from the kitchen. As soon as I became “independent” in my food storage, I was subjected to much less scrutiny. I managed to build up a solid 1-2 week ration supply after hoarding change.
-you can tape SD cards to the inside of book dust covers(the part that folds inside the actual cover of the book), if you have a sewing kit or zipper on it inside the stuffing of your pillow (trim a corner, stuff it inside, stitch it closed) or (this is final resort) VERY CAREFULLY remove the covering from your outlet and tape it to the wall stud before replacing the casing. I kept mine inside part of my wooden bed frame that I hollowed out using, you guessed it, take out silverware knives and 4 nights without sleep.
-THE FLOOR IS LAVA WAS KEY TRAINING FOR ME AS A CHILD. I learned to take pillows with me, climb on furniture to disrupt my flow of movement, toss a pillow down, and use that to cushion any rattle our living room could give off as I crept to the kitchen from the side entrance so my mom’s dog wouldn’t bark or alert anyone. I highly suggest crawling around on all fours like some sort of beast to stay out of sight.
-can you run your house blindfolded?? If you can’t. Maybe you should try to learn. I suffered some heavy eye traumas growing up and had a collective 3-4 months just IN THE DARK. Eyes bandaged, left alone. It was terrible, but damn if I couldn’t navigate the whole place silently, without any visual cues. This helps a lot with the whole moving around in the dark thing, too. Listening is obviously key.
-if your parents start getting suspicious, or you’re suspicious they’re getting suspicious, watch out for traps. String on the ground that gets shifted when you walk on it. Baby powder or flour left to track footprints or doors opening/closing. My dad was partial to wrapping a bungee cord around my doorknob and attaching it to the closet across the hallway. I wouldn’t be able to open my door enough to get out, or if I did, I risked ruining the structural integrity of the wrappings he did, and he would notice.
-learn to tie some knots. Strong ones. They’ll come in handy at one point or another.
-remember that you’re not totally alone. There’s people out there for you. Wanting to make everything better. You don’t deserve what’s happening, it isn’t normal, and you will eventually find help. But staying safe is important, and you are important.
It upsets me that people might need to know these but I know it could really help someone by reblogging
being able to get around your house blindfolded (or, you know, just in the dark, in the middle of the night, without turning on any lights) is SUPER IMPORTANT. im lucky because i have natrually good night vision, but even without it you want to be able to get around your house in the dark. don’t be afraid to use your hands as your eyes. its way more helpful than most people realize.
Watching out for traps is a really good tip. When I was really young, I would get up in the middle of the night to sneak food out of the trash (I know, not the healthiest, but I was like 4). My mom strung cat bells along the hallway and around the trash can. The first bell I hit, I bolted back to my bed and didn’t sleep for the rest of the night thinking she would come in.
Another tip: Halloween time, sneak as much candy as you can into your pockets in between each house. Chocolate always worked better for me. M&Ms have probably saved my life. The sugar can help on those days where you get the shakes.
When you open the fridge, break the seal first, then get the light off as soon as possible. There’s no point in being silent if you’re a literal beacon in the night. If you can figure out a way to hold the button down before ever opening the door, great. I would use a school ruler, and just slide it under the seal where the button was.
I know how tempting it is to eat everything you can find when your left in the house alone. DON’T. Take a little bit of everything, I’m talking minuscule. It’s less noticeable and can keep you from getting sick off of the same thing over and over.
When you get an actual meal, don’t inhale it. Try to chew each bite about 5 times first. It’ll keep you from over eating and throwing it all back up later. Make this opportunity count.
Learn who you can trust. My mother abused us for years, and no one in the family knew until very recently. If there’s an aunt or uncle or grandparent who you get to spend time with alone, TAKE ADVANTAGE. Take whatever they will give you. A bath, a sandwich, a drink, a nap, anything. It may be a while between visits, and you don’t know when you’ll get those things again.
Stay safe. Please.
Also (mod desi here). This may sound like the same old “I’m here for you advice” but it’s something I wish I had done. If there is someone in a position to help you, TAKE IT!!! I spent years with an emotionally and psychologically abusive caretaker before my dad married my mom that took “care” of us while he was at work (she never hit me, but I believe she might have if she wouldn’t have had to account for the bruises to my dad). I never said a word about what I went through during his long shifts because I was afraid. I wish I had. My dad loves me to pieces and he was in my corner through everything and he would’ve done everything in the world to make it better for me. If I had only spoken up, I might have saved myself years of emotional trauma. If it’s not safe and there’s no one you can tell, definitely follow this advice, but if there’s someone who could get you into a more secure situation, especially if there isn’t fear of being put into the foster system or that person would take you in (like the other parent, a close relative, etc.) take it. If you can relatively safely get out but you’re scared, take a leap of faith. That is my survivors advice. I know it’s terrifying, but I’m telling you as someone who wished they’d done it.
I know this is supposed to be helpful but really you guys sound like you’re giving pointers on how to be a better crook.
@iamcuziam I know this seems ghastly in the casual way the pointers are given, but it’s not always safe to tell someone. While there are some situations in which conquering your fear and telling someone who can help, in some cases when there’s nobody else in the family who could take them, telling someone or trying to get out could result in being put into the foster care system, and while it could be better in a foster home, it could also be worse. Getting out of a physically abusive home only to go into a sexually abusive foster home is a very real possibility in a lot of places. Sometimes it’s better just to try to survive, and I love that this post is accepting of that and isn’t saying “you need to go to a social worker or the police no matter what” because the system is so fucked that doing that makes it worse as often as it makes it better. Also, the blasé manner in the way this advice is given is really nice because it doesn’t treat kids in this situation as if they are broken or fragile or creatures to be pitied: it treats them like human beings. And that means a lot to kids who can’t get out just trying to survive. I hope that clears things up a bit.
Kids. Teenagers. As someone staring 40 in the face lemme tell you a thing.
You are going to be horrified and embarrassed at some point by the shit you are doing now.
And you are going to wish with all your might you’d done more of it.
You’re gonna wish you had more selfies, more photos, more videos being dumb with your friends. You’re going to wish you’d had your hair even higher or your shoes even sparklier.
Go. Document the shit out of your ridiculous life. Fuck trends but if you wanna be trendy, go all in. Fuck in-groups and subcultures but if one sings to you, do it all. Be exactly as cool or punk rock or goth or fandom or country or hardcore or hip hop or whatever, and don’t let anyone tell you differently.
Just don’t hurt people. That’s the only thing you’ll ever genuinely live to regret.
I think I have talked about this before, but because life doesn’t end at twenty or thirty or forty or fifty and thinking that folks are going to fall out of social media or that there won’t always be someone your age and my age and twice both of our ages interested in [insert anything, ever] is a very limiting worldview.
Somewhere there is a sixty-five year old who unironically loves Taylor Swift’s music and a fifty-two year old writing Superwholock fanfic and a ninty year old who absolutely lives for the next episode of Archer and a seventy-one year old that can kick anyone’s ass in k-pop trivia. There will always be these folks, and all the Internet has done is give fans of all ages a chance to interact in a way that they never had before.
Before BBSes and the Internet and Usenet and the World Wide Web and fanrings and forums and social media, those people would just love it in their own way, in the privacy of their own homes. But now anyone can make an Ao3 account or a basic fansite or tumbl about whatever they want, and sometimes you’re gonna learn those people are old but they still get it, and sometimes you’re going to find out those folks are still kids, twelve or fourteen at the oldest, and marvel at their maturity and skill and attention to detail.
And that is rad as hell, that is fucking incredible, that is… whatever the kids are saying these days, hah.
As a sidenote, once, about a decade ago, I decided to email one of my favourite authors before she bit it … she was pushing 90 at the time. ( … she’s still alive now).
Anyways, we got to having a long discussion, because I shared my deadname with her late husband, and I actually had quite a long conversation with her.
The part of the conversation I’d like to share with you about this now pushing 100-tear-old author isn’t that she developed a liking for her breakfast eggs from her honeymoon in Vienna, or that her Husband would sometimes steal her drafts to read them as soon as he could, or that she superglued a potted plant to her bookshelf to watch her orange cat try to knock it over and fail.
Nono, I mention this to bring up what she would do as a writing exercise whenever she didn’t feel like writing her serious work.
In short, erotic darkwing duck slashfic. You can find it online.
This is the greatest addition this post has gotten so far.
I LOVE THIS FUCKING POST.
I love all the posts written by older fans, with their insight, and their generous attitude towards young fans, and young fanfic writers, and young fanartists.
Older fans who patiently explain to whomever questioned the validity of older fans participation…
that it’s older fans running the AO3 servers and the entire OTW organization;
Older fans most often writing the actually well written fanfic;
Older fans planning, organizing and executing massive cons;
Older fans who write out fandom history dating back to pre-internet so that history can be known and preserved and enjoyed;
Older fan lawyers enforcing Fair Use lawspro bono to keep fans from being sued for creating fic or art or any other media;
Older fans behaving well with life-lived-and-learned healthy boundaries;
or conversely dealing out smack-downs to those not behaving well be they older trolls or naively inexperienced younguns;
Older fans letting fans of all ages remember that zany enthusiasm is not the province only of the young – it is the province of humanity.
And we’re right there loving being human with you.
I’ll say yet again, Tumblr users are older than we think. There’s nothing unusual about a 40-something on here.
This started out as something great and turned into something better
Age is just a number but fandom is forever.
Young people today always think they control everything and that everything is about them.
I blame it on the we’re all special winners philosophy they are all growing up under.
No. Hell no. Do not come onto my post that is all about telling kids to enjoy their youth and be weird, and pretend that it’s OK to yell about young people and their specialness and participation trophies and related nonsense.
Young people are AWESOME. They are enthusiastic and thoughtful and self-aware and creative. They give life and joy and effort and thought and work to fandom. I will take one well-meaning and enthusiastic teenage girl over a dozen half or ironically committed adults any day.
Lots of them are unaware of fandom history because we have been very shitty at keeping fandom history – and that’s on us.
Lots of them don’t care about ‘elders’ because they don’t know they exist, or because they’ve been socialized to believe they shouldn’t exist, that people have to ‘grow up’ sometime – and that’s on us.
Lots of them want elders, they are delighted to discover that they can grow up and keep being as weird and awesome and wonderful as they are right now, that they don’t have to ‘become an adult’ by giving up everything that brings them joy. The notes on this post prove it.
And then lots of them are down on elders because we treat young people like shit a lot of the time, and they are not willing to put up with being treated like shit. I give kids today a lot of credit for refusing to put up with nonsense. That takes strength and courage and self-esteem and love for their friends and for humanity, all things we should encourage.
People have been bitching about the ‘special winners philosophy’ thing since at least Gen X (that’s as far back as my memory goes), and we’re about two and a half generations out from that now. This new crop of kids is hyper aware of when they’re being condescended to, and have no need to respect something without that respect being earned. They don’t think too much of themselves, they just want the same basic shit that everyone’s always wanted only now it’s harder to get – and considering that their parents generation had those things, it feels like an actual loss rather than a hopeful dream for the future.
And let’s remember: they never asked for the participation trophies. Adults did. And participation trophies don’t actually make you feel good, they make you mistrust praise and devalue outside encouragement.
Basically, fuck this attitude in general.
Also, “fandom” is now starting younger (and has been for some time) because fans of franchises aimed towards younger people now have a way of finding fellow fans far, far easier than when a lot of us were growing up. And if their first fandom is for an original property aimed at teens, chances are most of the first other fans they meet are going to be close to them in age, so *of course* it’s going to seem to them like fandom is *for* younger people. That’s not entitlement, that’s basic extrapolation from their experiences.
Not to mention they’re probably getting that, “Loving [show X / book Y] is for babies, when are you going to grow up?” bullshit from at least one older-than-them person in their lives, in which case, they’ve already been told that being passionate about fiction is a sign of immaturity, something that adults shouldn’t do- so why are we surprised when they internalize that?
So, first, the post I’m responding to is here, and I’m taking my own advice and not potentially being an ass on someone else’s post.
(To summarize the other post – OP is pointing out that being mentally ill is not an excuse to stop doing things like showering, and sometimes you just need to take a shower. First comment in the thread is someone being an asshat. OP responds and is justifiably upset, and pointing out that they’re talking about things they learned in therapy for their own mental illness struggles. Another person is responding in support of OP after that.)
DBT (dialectical behavior therapy) can be awesome for those it works for, and for those it does, YAY, GO YOU!
However, it doesn’t work for everyone. Sometimes because there’s a chemical imbalance that needs store-bought neurotransmitters to help the brain work right, and no amount of will power or behavioral therapy will fix that.
Sometimes because of co-morbid conditions that make it exponentially harder to do things because of other symptoms – like executive dysfunction or sensory issues.
Sometimes because of chronic physical illness that makes doing things difficult because of limited mobility, chronic pain, chronic fatigue, or other physical limitations.
And telling those people to just get up and do the thing, especially a thing like a shower… isn’t helpful. It can make them angry and want to lash out because they know that it’s not just depression that is keeping them trapped, and limiting their ability to do things. (Also, yes, some people are just asshats, mental health issues or not.)
That doesn’t mean it’s right to actually lash out like the first comment on the other post, especially in a relatively public forum like tumblr. It doesn’t mean they need to tear down people who can benefit from it. And I wish more people were able to remember that, and if they need to scream about that, to do so on their own post, or even just save it to drafts and return to it later, and decide if they really think it’s still a good idea or it’s better to delete the post.
(Do not ask how many times I’ve wanted to tell someone they’re wrong and saved a draft and deleted it, because after thinking about it, I can go “well, it’s not something at all useful for me, but if it’s good for them, go them, I’m going to go be over here ignoring that and doing my thing”.)
And you know, to go to the original post’s example of a thing to “just do” when you’re fighting brain weasels – there are ways to keep clean that do not involve going through the momumental effort it can be to get a shower, and all the steps they take.
Wet-wipes, if you aren’t allergic to the contents*. A small bowl, a jug of water, and paper towels. Wet your paper towel in the bowl, wring it out, use that. You don’t have to get out of bed to wash your face and hands (under arms, under boobs if present, genitals, ass, and feet). Throw paper towel away. Repeat with as many paper towels as you need.
If you have enough energy and motivation and executive function to do so – warm water from the tap and a wash rag. Same routine. Clean without all the fuss of a shower. Maybe at some point you can get yourself worked up to a shower, and if you can’t, that’s still ok. You’ve still got options for keeping clean
Clean clothes – shelf next to your bed. Underwear at the very least. Other clothes if you’re up for that.
Set a timer or alarm for doing things if that works. Enlist a friend or several to remind you about one or another thing. (And if you can, help them with things they need to remember.)
*I can’t, because I cannot find wet wipes I’m not allergic to one thing or another in them.
It’s not just about training your brain. It’s about understanding yourself, and knowing when this sort of thing will work, and when you need to try other things. It’s about knowing that not everything works for everyone, and going “just do the thing” to people for who that doesn’t work for trying is not helpful. About knowing that going “well, fuck you, that doesn’t work at all” isn’t helpful either, because rude and also, just because it doesn’t work for you doesn’t mean it doesn’t work for others.
(And, for anyone wondering – depression and anxiety that stem from poorly diagnosed and untreated ADHD, and several years of bullying both at school and from relatives when a child, some of which was very badly handled and none of which has been professionally addressed because access issues. Chronic pain and other physical issues on top of that, again, not well-treated because access to decent medical care is crap. And do not get me started on accessibility issues of the property.)
like, i’m not saying that adults don’t have a place in fandom. they can and they do, and many are perfectly great people.
but if you’re an adult, say, in your mid to late 20s or older, especially if you’re in a fandom that’s filled mostly with teenagers, you do need to be careful about how you interact with young people in fandom.
you need to be careful about the content you produce or share, and if you do something that people take issue with, you need to be prepared to address that in an honest and meaningful way, instead of blocking the young people who are telling you you’ve done something wrong and going on a rant about how “it’s just fiction” and “ship and let ship” and “do whatever you want” and “i’m too old for this.”
if you’re an adult in fandom, you need to be able to recognize how the content you produce might affect young people, and honestly, you should be able to show maturity when dealing with it, because you are still an adult talking to many people who are literal children.
many of those young people will, by default, view you as a sort of authority figure based on your age alone, as that’s what they’re used to. be careful of the lessons you teach them.
Hm. Okay. Here’s the thing.
We all know who you’re talking about and which situations you’re talking about. What you really have an issue with isn’t anything to do with anyone’s age, it’s about people producing things that other people find hurtful, then not responding the way the hurt people would like them to when called out on it. That can and does happen anywhere, regardless of the ages of the people involved. It’s a separate issue that should be discussed and dealt with.
And yes, in some of those recent situations, the ages of the offenders or the offended were brought into the discussion, by both sides at different times. The age difference does complicate things, but that doesn’t mean that it’s the main issue.
You may be thinking “why do you care if I focus on age, it was a salient part of the argument for me, you’re trying to defend adults who don’t care how their words hurt children!” But here’s the thing.
You may not realize this, but in other fandoms adults have been doxxed, have been threatened, have been outed because they were creating things that someone, somewhere deemed “dangerous for minors.”
Adults who were creating things that were not meant for minors, that were openly and blatantly tagged as being NSFW, explicit, as containing triggering material. I’ve even seen people who weren’t even creating the offending material being harassed, bullied, and threatened, for daring to stand up for the people who were. Not even just online, but in person. I’ve been a victim of it myself, though not to the extent that I’ve seen many others go through.
All because a segment of the fandom decided that because certain content could be dangerous for minors, it should never, ever be posted anywhere a minor might possibly read it. Adults who do post it are responsible for every bad effect it could possibly have on anyone who reads it and are horrible people for not willingly taking on that responsibility.
I know the situations you’re talking about are different. In many of those situations, adults chose to interact with the minors who were complaining about them, and yeah, when you’re choosing to directly interact with a minor you need to tread carefully.
But once you go down the “adults in fandom are responsible for the minors in fandom” road, if lots of people start clinging to that mindset, that is where it can lead. And that is an extremely serious issue. It can literally destroy careers and ruin lives.
I am not in this or any other fandom to produce content for minors. I have asked many times for minors not to follow me; I don’t block them, but I know quite a few people who block any minor who follows them. I produce enough SFW content that I don’t mind minors being able to, say, reblog it from others on their dash, but I do not want them following me and getting explicit content directly from me, full stop. If it becomes an issue, I will start blocking people.
If you’re a minor, I’m old enough to be your mother. But I’ve got my own kid, and I’m not in fandom to babysit anyone else. When I create or reblog content, I do not and will not take the presence of minors into account when doing so. Because that is not my job.
Now, right now I’m choosing to get involved in this discussion, which will involve people much younger than me, including minors. So yeah, I’m being careful about what I say and how I say it. And I agree that any adult who willingly engages in conversation with minors needs to do the same.
But I simply can’t agree with your last two paragraphs. Those “literal children” already have parents. If their own parents aren’t monitoring what media they consume, aren’t having conversations with them about problematic messages in media, it certainly isn’t my job to do so. Period.
This is an excellent time for teens in fandom (and in general) to stop seeing every adult they come in contact with as an “authority figure” and start viewing us as human beings who are living our own lives with our own motivations, problems, desires, and inclinations that have nothing to do with them. That’s something that will serve them well in life.
How people interact with oppressed groups they aren’t a part of who complain about their representation of those oppressed groups is an entirely separate issue that is not about the age of the people on either side. Age can complicate it, especially in that it can be difficult to communicate across a generation gap when people on either side have such enormously different experiences. I think that that has caused some problems.
But any adult who is not willingly choosing to interact with a minor is not responsible for minors who consume their content, and conflating the two issues is downright dangerous.
@porcupine-girl nailed it 100% but this especially bears repeating:
This is an excellent time for teens in fandom (and in general) to stopseeing every adult they come in contact with as an “authority figure” and start viewing us as human beings who are living our own lives with our own motivations, problems, desires, and inclinations that have nothing to do with them. That’s something that will serve them well in life.
Fandom is a good way for teenagers to learn how to interact with people in different age groups as peers. Because that’s what we are, we are fandom peers posting on the same web sites and obsessing over the same shows and no one in fandom has any authority over anyone else (no matter how much some people might try to claim it). I am not your teacher, your parent, your babysitter, or anyone in any position of authority over you or anyone with a responsibility for taking care of you. Nor am I willing to take on that role. The vast majority of the billions of adults in the world fit that description. Only a very few, ones you know in real life, are responsible for you personally – and soon that number will be none as you become an adult yourself.
I block anyone with an age under 18 listed in their profile if they try to follow me – not with any animosity, I’m just not interested in interacting with kids on a fandom level. This is a completely valid option and I think it’s a wise one.
Plus the original post here is predicated on the assumption that fandom belongs to people in their early 20s and younger and the rest of us are just hangers on. Sorry baby, look at the demographics; you’re the minority. We’re not in your house. I, for one, am happy to interact with anyone I have interests in common with and bond over those interests; I think people of all ages have exciting perspectives and interesting minds. But I don’t want to be treated like a second class citizen by anyone, and as said above, I am interested in interacting AS PEERS ONLY. I ain’t your mommy and I have enough people IRL trying to leech emotional labor off me, I got none for strangers on the internet.
I have watched my friends raise their kids in fandom. Literally. Raise. Their. Kids. I’ve watched young things I met carried in arms toddle, walk, run, be 8, 18, 28, marry, come to a convention carrying young things in their arms.
It was assumed that everyone who knew the parent would keep a vague eye on the child because friends don’t let friends’ little ones run into traffic. But at NO POINT was it ever assumed or expressed that the adult fans had to stop being adult fans talking about adult things. If a minor walked into the “How to write explicit bondage” panel, then someone gently suggested that this was not the place for the kid to be. If the kid found the dick pics in the art show, they were told “go ask Mommy what ‘slash’ means.”
I get that the OP wants to protect children, but while it’s my job to make sure someone too little to take care of themselves doesn’t get hurt, it has NEVER, through three generations of fandom, been my job to be anyone’s actual parent or to stop adulting around adults.
Oh, and the line “I’m not saying adults don’t have a place in fandom; they can and they do” – that line? Child, ADULTS BUILT FANDOM. We created the cons and the fanzines and the webrings and the clubs and the fan sites and the VCR tape swaps and the letter writing campaigns and the podcasts. We maintain the fan sites and the fic repositories and the conventions and the rest. Did you think those things just spontaneously evolved? Fuckin’ A we have a place in the culture that we built!
If you’re old enough to be online unsupervised you’re also old enough to police your own fandom experience. Head the tags and warnings, that’s what they are there for.
Also, to be blunt, I am not responsible for anyone’s children. Full stop.
“Try to tag your stuff appropriately so it can be avoided by those who shouldn’t be / don’t want to be seeing it” is a reasonable request, and benefits all ages.
“There are kids in fandom now, so that means you have to stop having the kinds of conversations that have existed in fandom since its inception, just in case a kid stumbles onto them” is ridiculous. Fandom was an adult space before most of us here were even born, and demanding it change entire aspects of its nature to cater to a demographics shift- as opposed to simply reminding people to be courteous towards the now much-present younger demographic and their needs- is NOT reasonable.
Fandom should be- and is- willing to remodel for the sake of the younger generations, but we’re not going to tear down parts of our house because kids mightignore the “Adults Only, Please” signs on certain rooms.
On a related note, how many adults have you told to get rid of any books on their shelves with mature themes because their children or visiting children might read them?
Ok, I am now imagining the first time Obi-Wan and the 212th suddenly get called into battle before they’ve had a chance to wash off and the Seppies are like “Wait. We thought they were joking about the dead Jedi General and his Ghost Battalion!” right up until the shots start to hit…
Also, Ahsoka would really like to know who the Master is that keeps showing up and playing along with the joke – he’s always in blue before just about anyone else but he never really says anything, just grins at their antics, and seems to disappear every time she decides to go talk to him. There can’t be that many older human males taller than Skyguy in the Order right?
!!! YES TO BOTH THINGS. Force-Ghosting Oneself becomes a v frequently used Ghost Company battle tactic. Waxer takes to it with gleeful enthusiasm.
and whenever Obi Wan is being Ridiculous during a mission and risking himself unnecessarily, all Cody has to do is pull out some force ghost dust and be like “you know what’s going to happen if you go through with that idea? THIS” and throw a handful of blue dust at Obi’s face
omg all these fake force ghosts with Qui Gon’s very real one, and none of the clones or ahsoka realize :’) the question here is whether Obi Wan knows yet or not. the potential for shenanigans!
My theory is that all the “fake” exorcisms had just enough in them to help make certain places more… permeable to the Force. The process is exacerbated whenever the Force juggernaut that is Anakin Skywalker is around, so Qui-Gon has quite a few options for manifestation these days. He prefers the Temple grounds, but has been known to show up on the Negotiator from time to time, and he very much approves of Commander Cody and his men.
As far as being recognised, the issue is that it’s not totally there yet, and no one is actively looking for him, so most of the time any Jedi who does notice him assumes the same thing as Ahsoka. The exceptions are people who knew him in life, but given all the other nonsense going on Mace just thinks he’s hallucinating it…
It all comes to a head when in an unrelated conversation turns to whether or not Master Kenobi can be considered short for a Jedi, and his rebuttal that “Yes Anakin but you are an anomaly” leads to Ahsoka finally asking about the strange Jedi and…
Out come the incense and candles, and this time, with the Jedi involved actually focusing on trying to make it work for real, a pale blue figure begins to emerge.
No one says a word. No one living.
“It is good to see you again Obi-Wan. Please don’t be so hasty to join me.”
Qui-Gon Jinn smiles, and for the first time in decades, it is reciprocated.
i am so!!! there are lots of tears and Heartfelt Conversations and maybe Qui Gon’s presence actually manages to make Obi Wan (a tiny bit) more careful. also I love that literally the second sentence Qui Gon says to Obi Wan is to call him out on his Unnecessary Risks.
plus, now Ghost Company’s force ghost trick gains a lot more credibility when a actual ghost is sometimes breezing through things alongside them
“You don’t want to die, little one. It’s all medics up here and they’re waiting just for you,” is enough for Obi-Wan’s self-preservation instinct to kick in.
😀 Why do I think that Ghost company makes a make-shift ancestor altar just to commute with Qui-Gon and snitch on Obi-Wan?:D
Makeshift? Hell no. By the time they’re done with it the shrine is an integral part of wherever they’re stationed, able to be quickly packed for transportation and capable of surviving a direct hit from a tank. They may not always be able to see him unless one of the generals of the commander is around, but “General Jinn” is always watching out for them, and it’s polite to thank him and keep him in the loop about General Kenobi’s wellbeing…
The 501st don’t take long to requisition a version of their own. It quite literally doubles their chances of being able to find someone to talk General Skywalker out of whatever ridiculous plan he’s come up with this time.
(Also, Jinn tells the best jokes – the stories about his time as a Padawan are particularly great, if only to see Dooku turn ghastly pale when they interrupt one of his monologues to sing a certain Huttese folk song. )
And it’s nice to see the way their Jedi all seem… Happier. As far as the Clones are concerned, those altars are critical military equipment!
….is it standard procedure for the clones to cover themselves in force ghost blue before these Talks? i feel like it is. Qui Gon lowkey thinks of Ghost Company (and the 501st) as family, so of course he’s always going to be there to listen and do what Must Be Done! plus it amuses him endlessly to watch Obi Wan telling Anakin off for the same things Obi used to do
Covering yourself with pale blue talk is an integral part of the Afternoon Tea With Qui-Gon Rite. They have to buy it in galons.
Qui-Gon, of course, visits Dooku. Some call it infiltration. Other call it sabotage. The less trustfull folk accuse Qui-Gon of betrayal.
Dooku calls it “1001 reasons why retirement via lightsaber is a great option” because nothing gets on his nerves as this semicorporeal library of every possible emarrassing moment of Dooku’s life that happily reminds Dooku, Obi-Wan, Anakin and literally everyone willing to listen.
RETIREMENT VIA LIGHTSABER. Dooku pausing midfight to tell Obi Wan to PLEASE JUST TAKE YOUR MASTER BACK, I HAVENT HAD A MOMENT OF PEACE,,
Well maybe if you stopped the whole war thing and the sith thing and the chopping off grandpadawans’ arms thing, Obi Wan tells him, in no hurry to call his master back
@norcumi *dazed* Wow, didn’t realize I was going to kick off a thing like this…
Innit WILD when folks latch on to a thing? Go you, and yay everyone contributing!
Wait, wait…. Is that seriously it? How their clothes go?
that genuinely is it
yeah hey whats up bout to put some fucking giant sheets on my body
lets bring back sheetwares
When you’re carding, spinning and weaving everything from scratch, using the big squares exactly as they come off the loom must seem like a fucking brilliant idea. 90% (or more) of pre-14th century clothing is made purely on squares (and sometimes triangles cut from squares).
How did they get the fabric so fine it draped like that? Was that something medieval europe forgot? Or do I just have a completely misguided image of historical clothing?
The way they could get away with pinking and slashing doublets in the 16th century was partially because the fabrics were so tightly woven that you could simply cut a line on the bias and nothing would fray.
Modern fabric machining sucks ass in terms of giving us any kind of quality like the kind human beings produced prior to the Industrial Revolution.
*yells about textile history*
Reblogging because it’s fascinating.
The Celts made very fine clothing as well. They invented plaid after all, and the same weaves that have been found at the La Tene/Halstatt salt mines in Austria were also found as far away as western China in the tombs of the Tarim mummies.
Can we talk about 18th century and regency era muslin as well because that shit is gorgeous. It’s so fine it’s more transparent than silk chiffon and oh the tiny hems you can make with it!! I have an 18th century neckerchief and the hem is about 2mm wide. Not kidding, 2mm!!! Because it didn’t fray like our stuff does now. All we can produce nowadays is a rough, scratchy, bullshit excuse for muslin and it’s horrid.
I love this because we’ve gotten so blind to what makes ‘good’ fabric now – machine lace? horrible scratchy shit mostly made from poly. Actual lace is handmade, lasts for fucking EVER and looks stunning.
Regency gowns fucking rocked in terms of fabric quality – we use muslin as a ‘throw away’ before sewing the real fabric, back then it WAS a real fabric and it was so finely made you wouldn’t even think it was the same stuff.
Hand hemming is still the best way to finish off anything, but harder than hell because of the shitty weave of modern fabrics.
Satin? Silks?!
Pah. Yes, fabric is cheaper, more affordable and varied than before, but it is an area where QUALITY was sacrificed for QUANTITY.
(I don’t want to seem like I’m shitting on how great we have it now for clothes and martials or anything, because YAY!! but also, I’d love to get my mits on a bolt of real Muslin)
archaeologists recently found some Bronze Age fabric woven on site and preserved in marsh in England. it’s fine to die for. they were exporting it and trading into Asia.
I’m not into fashion, but I love reading about the history and evolution of it.
My favorite textile history fact is that the ancient Romans loved really sheer, floaty silks, but at the time the fashion in China, where the silk was produced, was for heavy, intricate brocades. So the Romans would import the heavier fabrics, painstakingly unravel them, and use the silk thread to weave the fabric they liked.
Agarlandoffreshlycuttears asked me to talk about my love of Boromir since I have a few Aragorn hate posts out there and boy does this topic of discussion take me back.
(For the record, a lot of my earliest opinions of Boromir was formed as an impressionable 14 year old experiencing her first head-over-heels male crush (I mean seriously, look at this guy:
) but people aware of my love of Thorin have probably noticed I tend to have a thing for complicated characters who experience a fall from grace. I find them much more interesting than characters who never need to struggle with morality or see a serious risk to their soul. I don’t hate Aragorn as such, but I have a lot of issues with the way his character was handled, so I hope the negative stuff comes across as more tongue-in-cheek and critique-oriented rather than bashing.)
So let’s begin from the beginning with some very Nuanced and Intellectual™ reasons to love Boromir.
So Into This At All Times, are as a worrying number of us. Do tell~~~!!!
Hey, I’d rather y’all be into alien sex than be like ‘they have sex just like humans :D’ tbh. Btw, I am bolding things that will help if you’re just skimming for a particular piece of information. I’m gonna go on for quite some time because you just poked a ‘Special Interest’ button. Strap in, kiddies, we’re about to get weird~~
(nota bene 1: this is assuming Cardassians have two sexes and two genders. Personally I hc that humans, with our five sexes and myriad genders, are the widest and most varied of the races, with Andorians not far(?) behind. Cardassians are also fascist iirc, and fascism generally locks whatever pattern in place is most reproductive bc ‘family values’)
What’s In A Name? Taxonomy
Now, crocodilians are Archosaurs, which is a group they share with birds. I decided that Cardassians are also archosaurs, so that means I can use bird traits as well as crocodilian ones to map out their courting rituals, sex, gender, nesting, and beauty standards.
You Want Blue? Beauty Standards and Sexual Display
So in canon we know the females have blue on them. This is really interesting to me, because reptilians (and, side note, we now know birds are reptiles. yep.) usually have this pattern:
male = pretty and courting
female = big and choosing
That is why male reptiles are the colourful little ones that dance around (’me me me me me!! pick me!! look how high i jump!’ – prairie grouse, birds of paradise), give gifts (’you like blue? i got you blue. you like pebble? i got you pebble.’ – blue bower bird and adélie penguin, respectively), and compete with other males (’look how tall i can be!! look how big and strong i am!’ – lizards and turkeys/capercaille/chickens, respectively), to prove their worth to the bigger, camouflaged, discerning females.
(A friend pointed out this may be why female Cardassians are considered better at science, where males are the warriors)
So why are females the colourful ones? Well, they may be using cosmetics, which may be symbolic of their social status in some way that can’t be noted normally (such as married/not married, or sexually mature/not mature); or else it might be a beauty standard.
Putting on makeup to redden/darken our lips and cheeks, and to redden/darken our eye area, mimics sexual arousal, and so the beauty standard of this sort of makeup arose from mimicking a sexual signal. That’s the kind of beauty standard I’m referring to, not the culture-bound ones like big tits (the west) or modesty (christianity) or suchlike.
So, if the Cardassian ladies are painting the blue on their faces, then why? Specifically, why is this attractive, and why are the female Cardassians trying to be attractive? I dislike the idea that a female archosaurs would display for the males, and blue is not a usual colour for flushing, unless you have blue blood. And you don’t have blue blood unless you live in a very very cold climate (see octopuses and horseshoe crabs), so we can rule out the ‘mimicry of flushing’ possibility.
That leaves blue as being, in a pre-society Cardassian, somehow a signal of something else. But what? Are the females looking more aggressive this way? Is it status display, like with a lammergeier bathing in red dust? Is it decoration and the blue is only ‘blue’ to us, but to their eyes, which can see ultra-violet, it glimmers and flashes? Is it something that only arose when Cardassian society went all fascist and militant, and the aggressive warrior males inverted the power structure and began to rule, and needed a way to make the females seem more decorative and objectified? Well, if pre-society Cardassians were originally like bower birds, and the males collected blue objects for the females to peruse, then marking the females with blue would be very symbolic.
This is assuming, of course, that females wear blue regardless of whether they’d be interacting with other races or not. We don’t see them unless they are (afaik), so we have to consider the possibility that the blue markings are actually there for other races, who can’t tell a female from a male Cardassian and need to be told in some ridiculously obvious way so they don’t misgender anybody.
Yet another possibility, is that our idea that the ‘female’ Cardassian is the one that lays the eggs is totally wrong, and the Universal Translator is interpreting ‘female’ in a flawed and human/mammalian-centric manner (’female ones are the smaller ones that raise the young’ will skew a lot of results!!; this is like ‘any featherless biped is a human’ and someone plucking a chicken and going ‘behold, a human!’), and the smaller, blue-marked Cardassians are in reality the male Cardassians. You can also do that if you like, lord knows I certainly have done something like that with the Ferengi and with Tolkien Orcs.
Like any good scientist, I’m not going to actually answer any of these as ‘this is definitely it’ because well, it could be any of these! So I’m just gonna move on to the mechanics of sex itself.
Egg or Squish? Incubation and Gestation
Eggs or live young? That’s a big question, and my fellow Cardassian xenobiologist, badmadwolf, suggested they were ovoviviparous, which means they birth live young by means of hatching the eggs within their bodies. This is a thing some snakes do. Obviously, archosaurs do not do this, but this is fiction, and we can reasonably reach over to Serpentes and borrow a few things and call that possible for an archosaur biped.
However, if you like egg-laying Cardassians, we can also say they lay eggs–with leathery shells–and hatch them–in incubator mounds (at least, pre-society Cardassians would; technology makes the need for a big mound of rotting vegetation unnecessary–but it wouldn’t get rid of the instinct to Pile Up All The Trash Really High a la australian brush turkeys or gators).
Either way, Cardassians don’t suckle their young, and are born ready to eat what the adults eat, with teeth and all.
(I am hand-waving the obvious tits on the Cardassians in the show as being a consequence of hiring human actresses and the limitations of a human being in charge of production.)
To Cloaca Or Not To Cloaca? Genitalia
Another question is the inevitable Do They Have A Cloaca? This is all down to personal preference. Some archosaurs have a very elaborate penis and vagina situation (ducks, famously), some have ‘vents’ (passerines), and some have a cloaca, and if they have a penis, the penis lives inside it, fully erect, ready to be pushed out during mating (really!). So the question is down to personal preference: Do You Want Garak/Dukat/Damar To Have A Cock, Punk? Well, Do You?
(My answer is always Yes, Bring On The Monster Peens)
However, regardless of what answer you choose, it’s likely they still have a cloaca–and, side note, do not pee. Or rather, there’s no separate liquid and solid waste, it’s all in the same packet as it were.
Hey, Sexy! Perfume, Purring, and Foreplay
Crocodilians have musk glands, and the male spreads his scent around to let the female know he’s dtf and in the area. This is a fun thing to have in combination with forked tongues/jacobson’s organs. I’m a big fan of scent being used sexually, but that’s me. Archosaurs don’t all do things with scent (though a lot more birds do than you might think!).
Cardassians, like a lot of crocodilians, may also have a ‘mating rumble’
that they do. It’s like a purr, but lower and specifically sexual, and
all gators do it to advertise they’re dtf. Crocodiles do this too, but
I’m American and I prefer my gators.
Another thing to remember is that Cardassians probably do a lot of foreplay/courtship before getting down to the bidniss. All archosaurs, crocodilians included, go through elaborate mating dances both to earn a mate and also afterwards, the mates dancing together for sometimes hours on end. Whether Cardassians are from monogamous or polygamous types of species is up to you, the spread of that is pretty mixed through the Archosaurs, from loons mating for life and singing together every night to crocodilians mating with several different partners and producing a clutch where each egg can have a different sire.
Please Think Of The Children! Family Structure and Chick-Rearing
You can take your pick of how chicks are raised too, from a single mating system, like hornbills who wall the female up in the nest and the male brings her and the babies food; or you can have gators, which communally raise their young in nursery pools; or pelicans, who have 2-3 chicks that compete and push weaker siblings out of the nest to die until there’s only one left (seabirds are brutal); or you can have brush turkeys, where the male makes the nest and the female lays her eggs in it then fucks off; or emus, where the dads raise the babies but will also look after literally any baby emus nearby (it’s hilarious why they do this). Archosaurs have such a huge range of chick-rearing behaviours that Cardassians could literally be anything.
Canon only tells us that family is ‘important’ and that families of several generations live together and work to raise their children. That could be artificial due to some societal pressure, however, much like agriculture changed how humans underwent courtship, mating, and child-rearing.
(nota bene 2: I am only in season two and haven’t got through/got access to all
the printed stuff that may have this info, so I’m working off the
information in s02e05 “Cardassians”, and what I could find on memory
alpha)
Somewhere along the way fanart become worth more than fanfic to fandom.
Artists have Patreon accounts where people pay real money to view their art early or to access special pictures like scraps or tutorials.
Whereas writers are expected to produce more and more, faster, for nothing in return. No one wants to see our “scraps” and writers who do provide Tips and Tricks often get crap for “policing” how people write.
And it falls into the prevailing notion that somehow writing is something easy, something anyone can do.
This isn’t an attack on fanartists. You deserve to receive some sort of compensation and accolades for your work. And so do fanauthors.
Writing fic is hard work. Yes, anyone can type out a story, same as anyone can pick up a pencil to draw, but what makes the difference, what makes a good piece is the experience and talent of an author. It’s all the stories no one saw, it’s all the writing books we’ve read, it’s the classes we have attended, all rolled into a package that works weeks, months, years to bring the fandom their fic. Yes we write for ourselves but we also write to contribute to fandom – just like artists do.
We’re just the same – artists and authors – and we deserve the same respect for our work.
Thank you so much, OP. And thank you to everyone who remembered us on Fic Writers Appreciation Day.
Let’s be clear, writing takes for-fucking-ever to do and it’s hard, lonely, strange, isolating, exhausting work. There is no art that is easy to make. NONE. All art is hard and deserves recognition if it has made you feel something or you enjoyed it.
Allll of this
As both an artist and writer, I have to say that I’ve been struggling and asked to write fanfic faster than I can produce, and I’ve been producing more art than fanfics because it is faster and easier to produce and more people come in. It drove me away from writing and honestly it does help when both sides are appreciated. As everyone else said, both take really long to create, and all should be deserved of recognition.
I can say writing is a lot more exhausting than drawing, but that’s my personal opinion.
^^^^^ this for days
I’m not saying artists have it easier, you guys legit blow my mind and I worship the ground you walk on But people pay for fan art while (most) people still don’t consider writing fan fiction to even be a skill. I’ve STOPPED telling people I write fan fiction because they just roll their eyes and ask if I write anything real.
Like, sorry if my 50k, heavily researched fan fiction with an original plot and excellent dialogue isn’t as “real” as the original six page story you wrote in tenth grade
A GODDAMN MEN. I’m so glad you wrote this OP. Something similar has been pinging around my brainspace for ages and ages and I couldn’t figure out how to say it. It’s like, here, take my soul and my heart and my ideas and my creativity and just *have it*, for nothing. Because I want to talk to you, because I want to connect with you, because we share the same fandom language. And somehow, in the last 3 years or so, Fan Authors have become the strange little hobbyists in the world of fandom, quality doesn’t matter, care doesn’t matter, research and talent and learning about writing doesn’t matter.
Which – if a writer writes a story and no one reads it, does it exist in the fandom? One wonders, and it makes it hard to continue screaming into the void if all you get back is the echo of your own voice, sometimes.
Having been around in fandom for a while, I have some theories about this shift–I think part of it is fandom’s migration to tumblr, which is much more friendly to art than text. But I think more than that is the broader acceptance and acknowledgement of fandom by creators, and what parts of fandom they can engage with.
Majority of creators–the overwhelming majority–won’t read fic for their works. Even the most pro-fic creators, the ones who write fic themselves, don’t do it. Because they have to protect themselves legally. If I write a fic that happens to match an idea that an author had, and the author reads my fic before writing down that idea, it looks suspicious when a book comes out that closely resembles my fic. It opens the doors to legal action where a fan could sue an author, if the fan had reason to believe the author stole their ideas.
So I get why majority of creators stay away from it. Fanart and cosplay are safer for creators to engage with. Majority of the time, there isn’t that same fear of stealing ideas. But as a fic writer, yeah, sometimes it really fucking sucks to see creators gushing over fanart and cosplay–works that absolutely deserve that praise, don’t get me wrong–because I know that they will never talk about fic the same way.
When I first got into fandom, eighteen-ish years ago, fic authors were the superstars of fandom. But over the years, yeah, fic has been relegated to second or third tier. And I’m not sure if some kind of balance will ever come back, where art and fic are put on an even keel, because one of those is able to be lauded by creators and one isn’t. I understand the reasoning behind it, I really do, and I don’t fault creators for making decisions to protect themselves. But there are times when it can be kind of demoralizing.
Reblogging this version too, because @rhiannon42 ‘s comment is spot-on. The ability to get “official” sanction and praise is a large part of why fanart is more respected than fanfic, and it’s not anything that will change anytime soon. It’s more than a bit depressing for authors, if you allow yourself to think about it too much.
There's a Mirror on the Wall 