I think the reason i’m curious about unstable sense of self is that often it’s people who would likely clinically have it–people with BPD in their username and #actuallybpd in their tags–who also get intensely political, too. (Like, take that recent post where someone said roachpatrol isn’t a guy because he likes dresses, and a real trans man wouldn’t.)
I got curious because I would think this kind of saying “you’re not a real [identity we share] unless you [are like me in this way]” would require a strong sense of self.
Like i would think otherwise you’d be all “well I don’t like that but if I’m not even sure who I am, who am I to say anything?”
Well, i think people who feel unstable want there to be more certainty in their lives, because it’s exhausting and scary not to know the answers to big, important questions like ‘who am i?’ And ‘what’s important and what’s irrelevant right now?’ And ‘what’s the right behavior in this situation?’
So you reach out for clear and simple answers that give you easy directions to follow. It takes a lot of inner confidence to be cool with ambiguity, with confusing situations, with unansweable questions.
“im a trans guy like THIS so trans guys must be like THIS or they are not trans right (because if they are like THAT and im not like THAT then maybe i am not trans right?)” is a very common feeling among people who are stressed out and miserable– insert basically ANY identity here. They don’t want one more piece of their life to be that much more confusing. And it sucks to bump into them and get yelled at, but like, it’s just not really your problem, so you don’t have to engage.
As someone who struggles with this kind of stuff, mainly due to near-constant dissociation and anxiety disorders, that seems pretty spot on. Of course, that doesn’t mean I would be justified in pulling that kind of shit, but there’s always this knee-jerk reaction of “well if they’re doing this right, and I’m doing it differently, then I’m wrong, so they must be wrong instead” when there’s not like..a “right” or “wrong” way to be trans, obviously.
There’s also a second aspect though, where sometimes you’re so certain that you’re being or doing x wrong, that your brain goes after people who are like you because if they’re like you and you know you’re doing it wrong, then they must be wrong. The first one is kind of a reaction to try to preserve a very fragile self image, whereas the second one is more the acceptance of self loathing. This is really the one I struggle with more, because my depression makes gender expression really draining for me, but that’s just me.
I think what’s important for people who struggle with that mindset, myself included, is to really familiarise themselves with these concepts and recognise where those feelings are coming from. Because while this is coming from a place of mental and emotional instability, we still have a responsibility to not be toxic and horrible to everyone in our vicinity, and it’s really not healthy either; it’s hard, but accepting that there’s more than one “right” way to be or do, is ultimately a lot more secure than lashing out constantly, because it gives one room to grow and experience instead of forcing oneself to stagnate forever.
Just one last thing, thought I would point out that this is basically the exact same mindset that is instilled in amab people and results in fragile masculinity. Which I know a lot of people take as a joke but it’s just as serious of an issue in regards to mental health, and also not something that exclusively affects men, as the mindset basically just adapts to different standards of gender presentation if the person isn’t cis.
great points!
Tag: identity
If you only want to describe yourself as “ace” and don’t want to talk about romantic orientation, or your experiences, or any other kind of qualifications, then that’s cool. Being ace is enough. You are enough.
If you only want to describe yourself as “aro” and don’t want to talk about sexual orientation, or your experiences, or any other kind of qualifications, then that’s cool. Being aro is enough. You are enough.
If you want to describe yourself as precisely as possible, stacking six different prefixes on each orientation you list, then that’s good too. I hope that you find the perfect combination of descriptions to draw a picture of yourself for others to see. Your precision is enough. You are enough.
If you don’t want to call yourself anything, you just need a place to be safe and learn- about yourself, about others, about the world- that’s good too. Your ambiguity, your shyness, your question mark, that’s enough. You are enough.
You belong here, with all the other LGBTQIAP+ people. With all the other MOGAI people. With all the other queer people.
These are your spaces, these are your communities, and you are welcome here.
You are always enough, no matter how open or closed you want or need to be.
You are enough. All on your own, you’re enough.
i’ve seen a lot of people concerned about questioning kids lately.
lots of people who were concerned that young girls might identify as nonbinary, for example, because of internalized misogyny. or young gay people who might identify as ace or aro, because of internalized homophobia.
i honestly have a lot of sympathy for people who mis-identify themselves. it’s something that most of us have struggled with at least once before realizing that we aren’t straight or aren’t cis. many of us have struggled with it twice, three times, or a dozen times!
it’s not fun to realize you were wrong. it’s not fun to live one way, feeling wrong and lost and strange and broken, because you wrongly believed that that must be who you are.
but. mis-identification is not caused by having “too many” options.
i understand this concern. i really do. I have no doubt that those examples i mentioned above do happen, very often. but it’s not really any different than my experience, and i would not blame it on any other person but myself. i was a “tomboy” little girl, i was gender nonconforming, i was a trans guy, i was a bi chick, i was a gay guy.
the way i choose to identify is ultimately up to me. i went through the trials of finding my identity in the haystack like everyone else.
i care a lot about the people who mis-identify, and i’d like to offer them support. this support does not mean that the groups that they mis-identified with are wrong or evil for allowing this person into their ranks. it means spreading the message that mis-identifying is okay! that it’s okay to change your labels as much as you want, and to try out different identities, and to change your mind or change over time. THAT is how you support a confused, questioning person.
try to remember that for every confused gay kid who thought they were ace because they couldn’t cope with the idea that they were gay, there was also a confused little ace kid who thought they were gay because they couldn’t cope with the idea that they were just “broken”.
try to remember that for every young girl who has been taught to hate femininity and herself, there is also a trans or nonbinary kid who is constantly being told “no, you HAVE to be a girl. there is no other option.”
we will make mistakes. everyone mis-labels themself. practically no one just knows themself without any effort – it’s a process of self-discovery, and it is painful and complicated. and we should be helping each other.
mis-identification happens when someone doesn’t know all of the options that exist. it happens because of stereotypes, because of bigotry, because of societal pressure and peer pressure and and and.
it is too complicated to blame on one thing. and you don’t know another person better than they know themself. assuming that is dangerous.
present all of the options to someone who is questioning instead of disguising, denying, or slandering some options rather than others. knowledge is power. that questioning person should be well-equipped to think, and try, and get to know themself, without you adding even more prejudice to the list.
concern is one thing, but pushing other people to identify one way instead of another because YOU think it’s right or better (or more likely!) is another thing entirely.
be careful. be kind. and support that questioning person no matter what they end up identifying as.
Language
(This post is going around. Since I pretty much like the post, I’m making my own post rather than introducing this in the responses there, but I do want to link to it for context.)
A really cool and classy trans lady I corresponded with for a while on a different social site used words like “transsexual” and “transgendered.” She spoke of herself as being born in the wrong body, and she spoke of herself as being biologically male, MTF.
She was in her late 60s.
I did not correct her. I would not in a hundred years have dared.
Given the social climate and hostility she had endured, I was fortunate to be speaking to her at all.
I have occasionally seen younger people criticizing older people quite harshly for that sort of thing. That hurts.
The use of language changes, my friends.
It is so, so very important to help people outside the community understand what language is most appropriate, and it’s important to discuss this stuff within the community so that we can reach some kind of consensus (however messy) moving forward.
It is also very, very important to respect the elders among us, and to understand that their experiences and the wisdom they have to share with us are of tremendous importance and incalculable value. And the language they use? Is part of their history, and our history, and respecting that fact in all its complexity is part of respecting them . . . and respecting ourselves as a community.
Language is so important, but in thirty years I guarantee you some of the language we defend so vigorously now will be woefully outdated, and many of us will still be clinging to it, much to the consternation of the younger generation.
I’m not saying it isn’t important to strive to create the most respectful, helpful language possible, and educate others when it is right to do so. It is vitally necessary that we do so. But we have to remember that this is a process that, thank heavens, never, ever ends.
Language cannot, and should not, stop evolving. Look at us. Look at all of us. So beautiful, so many. We are a dynamic community, a vivid community, full of art and history and passion and pathos and great, great power. Something so lively is always surrounded by change. That is so beautiful, and should be welcomed going forward … and it should be respected looking back.
There are words not yet invented that will apply to those not yet born. Those people should be respected when they join us. And the words we use now, they are good for now, and we should be respected. And our elders should be respected. Letting language take that from us is a horrifying prospect.
So. Let us not forget that language is primarily meant to be what helps bind us together. Let us remember not to let it set us apart, to squeeze us like a fist.
Please remember your history when discussing language. You will eventually be part of our history. You already are. Please. Go with open hands.
Yes. This.
This goes for other marginalized communities as well. I have a teacher who (in his words) “suffers from” depression. I am a strong proponent of the idea that everyone should have the right to define their own existence in their own words. So while I personally favor the neurodiversity model and I much prefer the neutral “has [x condition]” over “suffers from [x condition]”, I am not going to correct my teacher’s language because it’s his choice to define his depression for himself.
Thank you for bringing mental illness into this, because it didn’t occur to me, but there are many parallels, and as I myself am mentally ill and disabled because of it, I feel like I can actually talk about this with some authority.
Speaking as someone with an anxiety disorder and depression-dominant bipolar, I heavily identify with the “suffers from” narrative. Not everyone does. But if I said “I suffer from depression” and someone tried to “correct” my language to be more in line with what genuinely should be the default when you don’t know how the other person relates to their issue, they would get a gentle earful.
When someone tells you how they relate to some part of their core being, you believe them. If they use the “trapped in the wrong body” framework for themselves, respect it, don’t correct it. If they describe themselves as “suffering from X”, respect it, don’t correct it.
Some conditions do not inherently cause much suffering and while some people may indeed be miserable with these conditions, for the most part it’s society’s lack of accommodation that makes those conditions painful to live with. (From my understanding, autism, many forms of physical disability, blindness, Deafness, etc., would all reliably fall into this category.) (This is the social model of disability in a nutshell. The idea that if people were afforded necessary accommodations, these issues wouldn’t be too much of a problem.)
Some conditions absolutely tend to cause inherent suffering simply because that is what they do. What I have is, IMO, one of those things. While I personally know people who have the same exact illness I have and actively enjoy it (mania is apparently enjoyable for a friend of mine), most people who are bipolar, in my experience, do not. That is simply the nature of what bipolar is. Likewise, my anxiety disorder: if it did not cause suffering, it would not exist. That’s what it is. It causes discomfort, sometimes so acute I cry or feel like I’m going to throw up. You can’t accommodate me out of it, though you can damn sure make it worse by not allowing me to take care of it.
It’s a fact that if we accommodated these things better, the suffering would be less. For instance, if I were afforded enough money to live on each month, adequate medical care by competent professionals willing to treat me as the authority in my illness, and appropriate medication, I would be a lot happier. I do not have those things. I am absolutely made more miserable because of it. But no level of accommodation will stop my neurotransmitters – or lack thereof – from making me miserable from time to time.
The language that it is appropriate to apply to someone else may very well differ from what they use to describe themselves. There are some things it is not okay to impose on other people, even as it is perfectly okay to be those things.
Language develops and grows, and we are always seeking good terms to use that describe people without assigning them characteristics or narratives with which they may not identify. That’s a good thing. I get very frustrated when I see people complain about changing language, or “made-up terms”. That attitude is an active resistance to positive change.
I also get very frustrated when I see people trying to stamp out words without knowing their history, or respecting people who use those word, and have used them for decades (e.g.: “queer”, which you will pry from my cold dead fingers).
We need a better understanding of the necessary divide between personal experience and group descriptors.
This is a big thing in the autistic community. Older folks (I’m talking the >35 set by and large) lean more towards person-first language. Younger folks (like me I admit) lean more towards identity-first.
And there’s a good reason for that in both cases. Folks who grew up in the 70s and earlier were around for the early disability rights movements – they remember the time when identity-first was used to dehumanize and other. Person-first is their way of fighting back: I am a person, you will not forget that.
Younger folks were around for Autism Speaks and its co-opting of person-first language for its own bigoted ends. For the era of forced normalization, of passing, of “I Am Autism” and “Autism Every Day,” of being portrayed as demon-children while your abusers and the killers of people like you get fawning attention because it’s ever-so-difficult to be around people like you, and of personhood and autism being considered mutually exclusive and personhood being conditional on passing – so if you pass, you’re not autistic and don’t have a right to an opinion because you’re not severe enough, and if you don’t pass, you’re too severely affected to really understand how wretched you are, and therefore you don’t have the right to an opinion. For us, identity-first is a way of claiming our voice – it’s an extension of nothing about us without us. I am autistic, and I am a person, and you don’t get to choose which of those you respect. You will listen to me, because of both, not in spite of one.
What I’m pointing out here is that sometimes generations can have mutually-exclusive language preferences for what amounts to the same underlying reason, owing to differences in culture at the time of the generation’s coming-of-age. Person-first and identity-first are in fact mutually exclusive – someone cannot simultaneously respect my wish to be called autistic and another person’s wish to not hear autistic people referred to as autistic. But they’re both rooted in a demand for respect, a demand to be recognized as a full person.
The autistic community has mostly settled this issue by saying you have the final call in how you are referred to, but you don’t have the right to push others into identifying differently. The wishes that get respected in an instance are the wishes of the person being referred to. So you would refer to me as autistic, and you might refer to someone else as a person with autism, and both are okay as long as you’re respecting the identity of the person in question.
I think the QUILTBAG community could really benefit from taking that sort of attitude, too. Case in point: For me, I would never refer to myself as dyke and would get really fucking angry with anyone who did refer to me as dyke- I lived in a very old-fashioned community. Dyke was a tool of dehumanization and a threat. I hear someone call me a dyke and I’m 8 on the playground having my face smashed open on a chunk of ice to the tune of “Dyke bitch! Dyke bitch!” again. No amount of reclamation is going to lessen that association for me. But other people want to reclaim it as a sense of defiance – I’m a dyke, what of it? I respect their defiance, and I respect their right to choose the language with which they identify.
This is such a cool addition to my post. Thank you.
There's a Mirror on the Wall 